Wednesday, May 29, 2002

***** Logging started: 05/29/2002 7:19:25 PM

Ken Crump: I wanted to see where folks wanted to go with this topic tonight. OK. I think the first thing we should do when talking about this stuff is to agree on a vocabulary. Complementary medicine is a mouthful and most think that if you say complementary, you mean complimentary...or free! Alternative is a word I avoid like the plague. It implies that you can do things ONE way or ANOTHER way. That's not the intent either.

Nanette: alternative sounds too much like holistic to me.

David: same here!

Ken Crump: I'm fondest of "Integrated" medicine. Let's not jump off of holistic too early. Let's examine that word and see why there are so many triggers about it. What if it was spelled WHOLISTIC? Holistic sounds kind of holy

David: i like your thinking!

Ken Crump: But wholistic sounds whole and that's the idea behind the word. I need to go down the wholistic path for a moment.

Lynda: Preventative medicine could be viewed as holistic depending on how it is presented

Ken Crump: EXACTLY! Wholistic practitioners view disease differently than traditional western medical types. And it's an important difference. Now, I'm getting all excited, and I'm afraid my typing skills will suffer, so I may start abbreviating. Let me know if I throw in something you don't understand.

The wholistic Practitioner (WP) sees disease as a 4-step process. The first is called the energetic imbalance. Let's say the owner (O) presents with a cat. Owner says kitty isn't acting right. You and the DVM do a history, PE and run bloods and everything you would do and come up empty. You think she's wacko, but she assures you something is not right with kitty. That's because there has been a disruption of the cat's vital energy...that the owner can perceive, but you can't put your diagnostic finger on.

That would be the first step - an energetic imbalance. It can only be detected by intuition. Have I still got you all?

Lynda: yes
Nanette: y this is all really new to me so I do a lot of listening...my students have been to practices specializing in this and given great presentations
David: y

Ken Crump: Second step is the functional disturbance.

Now the kitty represents and o reports that kitty is going to the litter box more often. You run some tests. Still negative. But owner knows this cat's habits. Whatever the disruption of vital energy is, it's starting to affect the kitty's way of life. A functional disturbance.

Lynda: ! Been there--very frustrating

Ken Crump: The third step is INFLAMMATION

Now here's where western medicine can get hold of things. Finally something we can detect on our tests. There are signs on straining on urination; kitty might be painful, maybe crystals in the urine.

Lynda: But sometimes there seems to be no reason for the inflammation sterile cystitis?

Ken Crump: Yeah, this is stuff we all know how to treat.

The fourth step is pathology. This step is AMAZING when you take it into a different context. Now the body is changing to accommodate the disease process! The bladder wall is thickening... Let's think about that.

Nanette: I've seen that

Ken Crump: Can we open this kitty up and scoop out a handful of disease? Never. All we can see is the effect the disease is having on the body. Put another way, what we can see is how the body has ADAPTED to the disease. What a body system we all have.

OK. Who's still with me?

Lynda: y
Nanette: yep

Ken Crump: You see, to the wholistic practitioner...all disease is a disruption of vital energy. Vital energy? Do we all know that term?

David: yes
Lynda: y

Ken Crump: Vital energy is that energy that separates us from an EXACT us who's dead.

David: similar to chi, in martial arts correct? Your life force

Ken Crump: Oh yeah same stuff; call it chi; qi - soul; prana, whatever same concept. When that energy is disrupted, the body will react. PERIOD

The body will react in predictable ways, but the same disruption might manifest itself differently from patient to patient.

Case in point. Let's all put on our imaginascopes... Before you sits a Cocker, And a dobie. They're just sitting there looking at you. You suddenly yell at them! A huge BLAH!!!!! You've disrupted their vital energy. Now the dobie is going to bite you... and the cocker is going to piss on the floor.

David: very true~

Ken Crump: Same disruption of vital energy manifested two different ways in two different patients. One complete system of medicine revolves around treating disruptions with only energy. It's called homeopathy.

Homeopathy is a complete and distinct system of medicine base on the idea that all disease is a physical manifestation of a disruption in vital energy and thereby can only be CURED with energy.

But let's get back to 'complementary medicine' and how it might be utilized by we who are in the trenches. What I want you to take away from this chat is the idea that you can ADD a component to your traditional western practice. That component might take the shape of something as far out as Reiki, or something as traditional as nutrition. And by nutrition, I don't necessarily mean learning the brochures from Hills or Purina I mean to explore all the possibilities when feeding pets. Perhaps feeding them home cooked foods or raw diets.

Now THERE"S a can of worms to talk about, no? Let look at owner's kitty again. When the kitty presented in the first stage of the disease process...the energetic imbalance. Perhaps the Wholistic Practitioner would have reached into a different bag of treatments. Like nutrition, homeopathy, Reiki, Flower essences, Traditional Chinese medicine (TCM), or acupuncture. Not a complete list by any means. But if the practitioner had treated kitty at that stage of the disease...maybe it wouldn't have developed into the next stage. Hands are tired...questions?

Nanette: it just blows me a way. The interesting part is the use of homeopathic meds that actually simulate the disease process to fight the disease process.... did I get that right???
Chris: As a tech in a clinic who believes in using alternative treatments, how do you approach your employer/doc with suggestions when there is not a lot of research or trial using other methods?

Ken Crump: Great question. Because that's an issue that is common even in Traditional practices.

How do you approach a DVM with a suggestion...a suggestion about sedation...nutrition...antibiotics? How do we do it, and not sound like WE want to be doctors. There's an awful lot that's done in practice without any research evidence that it should be done.

Nanette: How does a technician fit into this type of practice? Do you still have the same duties as you would in a "regular" practice?
Chris: I take direction from clients who have sought out alternatives, and have been successful. Then I bring similar cases to the doc's attention

Ken Crump: Perfect! How is that received?

Chris: I also read everything under the sun. Most times he is receptive.

Ken Crump: When he's not, can you ask how the current case is different?

Nanette: so do you aid in the diagnostics, home care etc.
Chris: Sometimes, when I am very passionate, he will exhaust traditional means first. Yes, I try Nanette, I try to follow up with patients and clients and DOCUMENT.

Ken Crump: I think exhausting traditional means is to be expected at first.

Chris: Always

Ken Crump: Here's my suggestion.... generally speaking.

Nanette: so it is similar... just less blood and guts
Chris: Recently had cat with recurrent UTI and incontinence that defied EVERYTHING. Suggested Cosequin to support bladder-lining health and referred client to holistic vet. So far some improvement. I think in some ways doc was relieved because he was running out of answers!

Ken Crump: Nanette, similar? More than similar...same goal. Different language.

Chris, referring to a Wholistic Practitioner is GREAT

That's so advanced, really. When a DVM will refer, that's an acknowledgement of plausibility. "This" might work is different that "Nothing" we can do. My suggestion... Pick a single modality something that really speaks to you. Maybe it's homeopathy or acupuncture or, for me it was Flower essence therapy. Pick a modality and learn a ton about it. And make it known in your practice that you are interested in it. Look for places it might work well.

Chris: Would love to see a program that would certify techs in alternative medicine. We could then educate docs and clients in a non-threatening way

Ken Crump: You could say something like, "I was reading where there's been some success using "X" for this, in conjunction with everything else we're doing.

Chris: That is true. Tend to get too excited about many areas. Start using that "WE" word when referring to any treatment of any patient. "We" treat every patient who comes in the door. "We" decided to try antibiotics on owner's kitty
Are there organizations/journals/support groups to look to for support and information?

Ken Crump: Let the DVM hear that you consider yourself part of the treatment team. Internet is a good resource. So is the AHVMA-American Holistic Veterinary Medical Association. They have a website; they have annual meetings.

Chris: Great!

Ken Crump: I am right now trying to get them to present lectures for technicians at AHVMA meetings. I'm really excited about it, and I've been around these folks for a long time. I think I can influence some new opportunities for us. BY us, I mean those nurses/technicians who are interested in expanding their knowledge and careers

Chris: That would be wonderful. I find clients feel less threatened by other methods and more in control of treatment when they can cook own food or use an herb to help relieve stress of discomfort without fear of compromising kidneys or mental status.

Ken Crump: You got it. Complementary means just that...in addition to standard of care.

Chris: The light goes on. Have not heard that term until today.

Ken Crump: Which term

Chris: Complementary

Ken Crump: Great! Any other questions, comments before we wrap this up? Let me close with something to put this into perspective. Why should we study medical treatments that have no (or little) scientific merit? Because science doesn't determine if a substance works...it's just a tool to try and explain why it works.

For instance, let's consider anesthetic gas...We can predict it's effect; we can calculate it; we can compare one to another; we can chart a course that it takes through the body; we can show how it interacts on a molecular level; we just can't explain why the patient goes to sleep. ISN'T THAT AMAZING?!?!?!

Lynda: Thanks for an interesting perspective. g'night

Ken Crump: Bet you thought we know that one, didn't you. Thank you all for your attention. Good night.

Chris: THAN K YOU! Good night.
Nanette: Thanks Ken.... still struggling with this but really good stuff!

***** Logging stopped: 05/29/2002 8:20:21 PM

----- Conference Room participants: Nanette, Adrian, Chris, David, Debbie, Gloria, Lynda, Michelle, Miranda